The journey to become competent at recording

[Dan Shipway]

Hey everyone, I definitely wanted to make a thread (Another one? Wow is this kid Hyperactive or what?) talking about recording and other things of that nature.
The first thing I would like to ask is how to get the exported files sounding exactly the same as what is put in the tracks because I have found the ultimate guitar tone for rhythm and when I export it doesn’t sound as good?
As I said in a previous thread, I amnew to this so you may have to bare with me.

 

[Ed Seith]

There can be a lot of reasons, Dan, and it’s hard to guess with very little input. So, tell me, is this it:
Record track. It sounds awesome in my head.
Play back (single) recorded track in DAW (Digital Audio Workstation). It sounds awesome on my speakers.
Export to mp3. It sounds like shit through the same speakers!
Is that what’s happening?
If so: What DAW are you using? How are the levels on your Master Buss (where do they peak)? Do you have any effects on the Master, or the track (within the DAW, not the sound you’re recording)?
Let’s start there.

 

[Dan Shipway]

Hi Ed, that is the problem yeah. I amusing Reaper (free version) and I have bias fx going through 2 stereo guitar tracks. The individual tracks have volume maxed out as they were pretty quiet.
However, as far as I am aware the master has been minimally adjusted as the tone was just right when it was played back through my speakers before mastering.
Hope this makes any sense.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

You have to realise if you record a very quiet guitar with a very weak signal and then decide to boost it, you will also increase the unwanted noise so it will sound like shit. To prevent that you need to add gain with your preamp on the interface and then you will have a stronger signal won’t get that unwanted noise.
Second thing is that guitar should be recorded in mono and not stereo unless you have some kind of a stereo delay or reverb.
The last thing, mp3 is a compressed file and it won’t have the same quality that you recorded it. That’s why you should export it as .wav because that’s a lossless audio format and there is no compression going on.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

oh yeah, also you should never touch the master fader, that needs to stay at 0dB all the time

 

[Ed Seith]

Not true, Filip. You can always adjust the master. As you listen through the track, watch the VU meters. Your track should not register ANY higher than -6db or so.
Back in the analog days, you compressed and EQ’d to get it as close to 0 as possible, but in the digital realm, that will give you shitty sounding saturation and bad compression, like what Metallica did to the final master of Death Magnetic.

 

[Ed Seith]

Dan, if I had to guess, your output is too hot. A high-quality MP3 mixdown won’t have a lot of impact like you’re talking about, so that’s not the issue unless you’re mixing it to like 64kbps or something – generally if you stick with 320kbps or a high VBR, there are very few people who would be able to hear a difference.
I have a feeling you’re sending the output too hot. I’m PM you with an email address – send me an mp3 of your output.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

You can adjust the master but that’s what mostly beginners do when they don’t know any other way to increase the volume. You won’t see any professional producer or audio engineer increase the master fader above 0db because they will use a limiter at the end of everything and they will increase the volume without touching the fader.

 

[Ed Seith]

No, but they will very definitely lower it.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

I don’t know, I don’t think so..
When you said that it souldn’t go above -6dB, I think you are talking about the RMS which tells you the average level of a signal. If that’s the case then that’s true, -6dB should be the highest it should go, but in EDM they can even go to -3dB but that’s kinda too much.
If you are talking about the peak meter then that can go to 0dB because that is showing you the highest peak that the signal is reaching

 

[Ed Seith]

No, in digital recording, if you hit 0, you’re clipping, and it’s not like the old analog clipping. EDM is fairly flat response and more predictable, because of the E in EDM. It’s not an organic instrument, and by nature, it’s not music that changes levels or has a lot of dynamics, so the rules may apply slightly differently.
But if you hit 0 AT ALL, you’re getting digital clipping, and it’s bad. You can mix at -12db even, and then just boost it in mastering with no ill effects. Again, not like the old analog days, where you maximized everything to minimize tape hiss.

 

[Ed Seith]

But yes, I do mean -6 RMS, but you still need to prevent the peaks from getting near 0.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

0db is still safe because limiters can limit the signal up to 0dB and nothing will clip. The signal will clip if it goes above that. But yes like you said you need to make headroom when you are recording or mixing.

 

[Dan Shipway]

Hey synners, just wanted to share a little tip on recording (most people know about this and may even use it but I thought it might help some people). I find that whenever I record a track I tend to turn the DI on so i can hear how the recording sounds but recently I have realised that on some occasions after reamping through BIAS FX it just didnt sound right or resonate right so I decided to load up BIAS while recording so I could hear what the reamp would sound like as I was recording and I have had really good results every time so If you are a bit concerned about the sound of your track after reamping, find the sound before and record with it.

 

[Jak Angelescu]

I’m probably going to subscribe to this forum topic because I have literally NO idea what I’m doing with recording. I had a friend suggest me an interface and he said “It’s super easy!” it took someone who had 10 years experience with recording software to figure out how to even get my guitar track to record. And it was something psychotic like a 4 step process!

 

[Filip Tomiša]

It is easy, you get an audio interface, install the driver for that interface, connect it with usb (if it’s an usb interface), open your daw (recording software), select the right input and output, and then you either record your amp with a microphone or you plug your guitar directly in the interface and you get some type of amp simulator and you hit record and that’s it.

 

[Noah Berends]

I’m studying audio and thought I would give my input regarding levels. 0DB from what I learned is the absolute max it should ever hit, the level you don’t want it to go above. In the film and video works specifically, -12 db is considerd the “safe” level that you want to shot for, and I was taught -6db for music. This is due mainly to the fact that 0db may sound good through YOUR setup specifically, but you have to account for the wide ranges of devices and speakers that might be playing your content. You wanna make it so it’s compatible with everything. .mp3 is heavy compression, so it won’t sound as good as exporting in lossless like .avi.
Also, Make sure the levels that go into your DAW never ever ever ever touch peaking ranges. You can fix audio that was recorded too quiet, but you cannot fix audio that was recorded at too high a level and clipped. Most modern interfaces have a knob to control the level before it even hits the DAW, and interfaces such as the amazing Scarlett range from Focusrite even have a visual indicator onboard. This is where you want to do all the tweaking as far as levels go. The DAW should only ever be responsible for minor touch-ups and small tweaks. “Fix it in post” is a pretty bad practice.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

0dB is the absolute max that it CAN hit without clipping but when you are recording you don’t really want it anywhere near 0db because if you start playing a bit louder or you hit the string really loud it can go over 0dB and it will clip so you want to make sure that your loudest part that you are playing isn’t anywhere near 0dB. When you finish recording, mixing and start mastering, the very last thing on the master channel is a limiter and what limiter does it increase the loudness of your song and the maximum you can go is 0dB, anything that goes above 0db will get cut.
Also something that confuses a lot of people is that DECIBEL is an amount that doesn’t have a measure but rather it expresses the ratio of a value to a reference value (it’s kinda hard for me to translate this correctly, bascially you need a reference to understand how much is a decibel). So when people say that 0db is the loudest it can go, that means that they are talking about the peak of a signal. When they say that it shoud be -12db, -6db etc.. they are talking about RMS (rms measures the average level of a signal).
When you said that “you can fix audio that was recorded too quiet, but you cannot fix audio that was recorded at too high a level and clipped”, yes that’s true but you also have to keep in mind if you have a very weak signal and you decide to boost it, you are also boosting the unwanted noise, so if your signal is very “thin” the ratio of your signal and the unwanted noise is really small and the more you boost it, the louder will your unwanted noise be.
PS. since you said a couple of times that you are studying film I have to ask what’s the best format to use for youtube when uploading a video with a .wav file? When i make a 3 minute video in Premiere Pro and export it as .avi (which can have .wav) the file will have 30GB and I don’t want to wait 100 years for it to upload on youtube. So rather I make an mp4 video and have a .wav file and then i put both files in a .mkv which supports both and also the file size is like 60mb. So my question is, is that the best way to do it or is there anotehr way?

 

[Noah Berends]

@filip, I use H.264, which is compressed, but good file size. .avi and .mov are lossless uncompressed, so they’ll naturally have really high file size. I recommend using that. But I am a bit confused, you said you combine .wav with a .mp4, is the .mp4 the raw file out of the camera? H.264 exports in Premiere will output the final product as a .mp4 file.

 

[Filip Tomiša]

I export the video as .mp4 with .mp3 and i also have a separate .wav file and then i convert that .mp4 to .mkv and then i replace the .mp3 with the .wav because MKV can have mp4 and wav. I think I tried exporting as H.264 (i think it was a default setting) but I think it didn’t let me choose a wav or maybe it did but not the 48kHz 24 bit.. I don’t remember